Adding an outdoor antenna - questions

[supermale]

Let me start with a little information on my setup:

I've got DirecTV, with the AM-21 off-air tuner. Right now, the tuner is hooked to a small, amplified antenna sitting on top of my entertainment center. With that, I get the "big 4" stations pretty well, but with occasional dropouts which last a few seconds. WTVM is especially bad, and I get no signal for WLGA. What I want to do is add an outdoor antenna, for the AM-21 and the other two TVs in the house. I am totally new to using an antenna, having last had to deal with one before I had cable.

Right now, I've got a pole outside my house, extending about 8' above-ground. This previously held my old D* dish, which has since been replaced in a new location on the property. But because it's cemented, the pole remains. My home is located in the Jordan High area, not far from St. Francis Hospital and Hilton Avenue.

My questions:

1) Antennaweb.org gives me this chart:



If I'm reading that correctly, and I buy a directional antenna, I'll need to point it roughly towards 122° - 142° to get the "big 4." Correct? If so, will it matter that there are trees in the line of sight in that direction? The trees are roughly 30 yards away, and they're not terribly thick, but they're tall.

2) I've seen the Channel Master 4221 mentioned here as a good product. Would that work well enough on the pole I mentioned? I realize roof mounting is preferable, but I'd sure love to avoid that if I can.

3) The 4221, along with other mid-range antennas, are listed as being UHF antennas. But I've seen some folks mention that these still pick up VHF signals. Being ignorant of how UHF/VHF works in regards to digital TV, I wonder if I'll need an "add-on" of some kind for VHF signals? Antennaweb shows WTVM as being VHF post-February 2009. Will that make a difference?

4) I've also looked at the Channel Master 3010 "StealthTenna" because it's listed as being VHF/UHF. Anyone have any experience with this model? Would it work better or worse in the pole-mount situation I mentioned than the 4221?

5) I don't watch a lot of PBS, but the Antennaweb chart says the signal is at 36°. With my pole mounted where it is, the antenna would have to be pointed almost directly at the house, less than 10' away. Am I out of luck with that channel? (Not a deal breaker, but I'm curious.)

That's all I can think of right now, but I may have more questions later on. Thanks for any help anyone can provide!

[Mike Slade]

Up until a few weeks ago I lived near Jordan High. With a 4221 I got all the major networks with no problem. It was mounted to my chimney and it was pretty high up there. With it pointed in the general direction of cusseta, i was able to get WJSP too without moving the antenna. I did have some breakups sometimes though and It wasn't on long so I didn't have much time to see how it really performed. I never picked up anything else though. No WLGA or the other pbs from alabama.

I never had much luck with indoor antennas at my place and I never tried anything outside other than my 4221.

[supermale]

I'll bump my own thread here with an update: I installed the 3010, because I got a good deal on it, along with a GE amplifier, because I'm splitting among 3 TVs. For whatever reason though, I cannot pick up WTVM at all. I get decent-to-good signals on the other "major" channels:
WRBL: ~50%
WLTZ: ~63%
WXTX: ~80%
WTVM: 0. Zilch.
(These signals are from the DirecTV AM-21 OTA tuner)

According to Antennaweb (see my image above), WRBL and WTVM are broadcasting from the same tower (or at least the same distance and compass heading). I could get a signal from an indoor antenna, although WTVM still wasn't great. My 3010 is pointed at some trees, and is only mounted about 9' off the ground. Is that the problem? Even mounting it on my roof, it would still be pointed at trees. If that is the problem, why can I get WRBL? Is WTVM lower-power?

What am I missing here?

[Mike Slade]

With my 4221 I think I had all 4 over 90% all the time. After all had upgraded probably over 95%. It was a steady signal all the time. No real breakups.

I would try to get some height on it. The higher the better. Also I don't really think you need an amp. Unless you just aren't getting anything without it, it's probably not helping much. If you haven't tried it without it, I'd do that. I'd also try a straight run to one tv just so you can tell how much splitting it is taking away from the signal.

I'm in phenix city now and I don't have an antenna hooked up. Yesterday, I did experiment with my 4221 over here and was able to pull in all of the four over 80%. I just had it on the pole propped up against the fence and kind of pointed it where I thought it should be. The pole is probably 10 feet or so. It had a pretty clear view (new neighborhood = no trees).

[supermale]

I'll try the straight run and see what happens. Without the amp, but with the same splitter setup, I was still getting nothing on WTVM, and ~20% on WRBL, making it unwatchable. I'm thinking the height is what I really need. Out comes the ladder, I guess. :-\

I wonder - does the antenna's proximity to the house make a difference? It's about 3 feet away, on the old pole I mentioned. The "back" of the antenna is pointed directly at a wall.

[seanmc1114]

First, let me say that I just switched to DirecTV and also attached an AM-21 tuner to my HD-DVR. I really like this for two reason. One is that I now get the program guides for my OTA locals from Columbus and Macon whereas I did not get them with my DISH VIP722. Second, it may just be my imagination, but I think I get better reception with the AM-21 than without it so I wonder if it has some sort of built-in amplifier.

With that said, even though I live in Reynolds and have my antenna combo (Channel Master 4228 UHF and AntennaCraft CS600 Suburban VHF with Channel Master 7777 pre-amp) on my chimney thus pretty high up, I get very good reception of the Columbus stations, even WTVM.

You mentioned you previously had cable. Are all of your connections RG-6 cable or is it possible it is the older RG-59? That could make a difference. Also, as others have suggested, splitting the signal between three TV's may be causing such poor signal strength. Finally, I have read plenty of times that when you are as close to the signal as you are, that an amp can actually result in lower signal strength than not having one. Overall though, I would bet that the lack of elevation on your antenna is your biggest problem if their are lots of trees nearby.

[supermale]

It's all RG-6 that I ran myself. I had the antenna split 3 ways without the amp, and was getting lower signals than I am with it, so I'm comfortable enough for now that it's not causing me problems. I haven't tried a direct run directly from an antenna to the AM-21, so that may be the next step.

There are lots of trees, including several directly in the direction of the transmitter(s). My chimney is engulfed by branches, too, so putting anything there is pointless. I'm really hoping elevation will make a difference, and I'll try that this weekend. If that doesn't work, the vacant house across the street from me has an older, tall antenna and mast, and I may see if the owner wants to "donate" it to me. It's now starting to really bug me, as I'm getting fine reception on the other channels. I don't "need" WTVM, but it's irritating me that I don't have it.

BTW, I love the AM-21 too, for the same reasons.

[alka]

Hey guys I live in Waverly Hall and I can pick up the 4 major stations and the PBS with just my indoor radio shack antenna. What would be the benefits of me getting and outdoor antenna if my indoor one is getting the job done. Will I be able to pick up stations from Atlanta or Montgomery because I was looking at the "DB8" antenna from Antennas Direct and it said that it has a range of 70+ miles on it. I just don't want spend money if I don't have to.

[Mike Slade]

I would say it's hard say until you try it.

[supermale]

[Bumping my thread again.]

While I intended to mount my CM antenna to the house, the weather intervened for a couple of weeks straight after my last post, and then I couldn't find the time to do it. However, my neighbor sold me the antenna off of her house, along with a 30' mast. This past weekend, my brother played Spiderman and climbed up on my roof to help me mount it.



Still plugged into the amplifier (because it was easier just to couple the line that was on the antenna to the line I already ran), and my signals on the "big 4" are excellent, including WTVM finally. Still no love on WJSP or WLGA. I'm not really bothered by the PBS station, as I get two via DirecTV. I'm hopeful for WLGA after the switchover, when they move to the tower in Cusseta (right?). The antenna is currently pointed at those towers, so have I done all I can? I'm "only" getting the Columbus stations, and I've read reports of some folks getting others. It won't bother me like the lack of WTVM did, but I'm just curious.